Bottom post of the previous page:
HONDA OPEN TO FACILITATING RED BULL ENGINE PROJECT POST-2021A bit of a twist in the who will supply RB/AT with engines after the Honda withdrawal from F1..... Honda management have said they are willing to allow RBR to keep its engines after its 2021 F1 exit so the team can develop them itself or with a new partner.
Commendable and I guess an honourable (morally quite Japanese in style) manner for Honda to bail out.... not just picking up their ball and going home leaving nothing to play with. More leaving their toyshop for the kids to continue to be able to play!
I think when Honda bailed as a team and sold to Brawn they were on very favourable terms... maybe to the extent of Brawn buying the team for 1 pound on the basis they took care of all the staff payoff costs and looked after their suppliers. Cant recall the exact details but I remember it was more than fair and ultimately made Brawn and his partners very wealthy.
https://the-race.com/formula-1/honda-op ... -post-2021“As Honda we had so many things from the teams, so we want to give it back somehow in a nice way for the future”
- Masashi Yamamoto
One alternative, which would likely require significant Red Bull commitment as well as agreement from all parties, is for Red Bull to assume Honda’s intellectual property and create a continuation programme for its engines, potentially with additional technical support from another partner.
The Race understands no such request has been made but Honda is willing to consider it as it wishes to make its exit as painless as possible, especially as Red Bull Racing and AlphaTauri helped make it an F1 winner again after three hard years with McLaren.
Honda F1 managing director Masashi Yamamoto told The Race: “Honda is happy to talk to them if they need us in any way, not only about the power unit but about other things as well.
“To support AlphaTauri and Red Bull for their programme after 2021 in any way, we’re happy to cooperate.
“As Honda we had so many things from the teams, so we want to give it back somehow in a nice way for the future.”
Asked if there is a limit to how Honda would be willing to help and if it that would stop a potential continuation project using Honda’s technology, Yamamoto said: “If that kind of request is made from the team, I am ready to speak to Japan.
“I personally want to support [what Red Bull and AlphaTauri do] as much as possible.”
Creating the infrastructure required to take over development of Honda’s engine would be a significant undertaking by Red Bull.
However, it has grown its facility at Milton Keynes, has major technical resources and partners, and could use it to redistribute some staff given the incoming budget cap in 2021 will force it to scale back its race team.
Building its own engine in the short-term is not possible for Red Bull but it may consider a rebadged continuation project realistic and preferable to becoming a customer again.
Honda started its Red Bull relationship in 2018 with the then-Toro Rosso junior team, as a precursor to a potential partnership with the senior outfit.
Red Bull was convinced early in the season to make the switch from Renault, with Honda dedicating resources to giving both the teams equal treatment as its de facto work outfits.
“However in the future, Red Bull and AlphaTauri may not have that kind of situation with other parties,” Yamamoto acknowledged.
“So, we want to support and help them in whatever way we can help them for the future.”
“For next year, we will not reduce any people from our project. We will make the biggest effort in order to win as much as possible”
The manufacturer is therefore committed to seeing out that deal rather than undertaking a rapid exit when this season is over, which gives Red Bull more time to establish what it does for its two teams.
Yamamoto said it has been a “disappointing” experience for himself and Honda CEO Takahiro Hachigo, who announced the company’s exit last Friday, as they wanted to keep the F1 programme going but had to respect the realities Honda is facing as an automotive company.
He said it was also “uncomfortable” because of the impact it had on two teams and F1 if those teams could not find a competitive solution, reiterating Honda’s desire to help ease the consequences of its exit.
“Our aim is now to exit the sport without making big [negative] changes in the sport,” he said. “That’s our target.”
Honda has promised to develop a new engine for 2021 without reducing its commitment, to try to sign off with a world championship challenge.
Though Red Bull and AlphaTauri have now both won with Honda, making it the only manufacturer to win with two teams in the V6 turbo-hybrid era, this season has not met expectations of a title assault.
However, Red Bull is optimistic it may be able to challenge Mercedes next season, something Honda insists it will be dedicated to trying to achieve as well.
My only worry about such a project is how RBR would be able to fund such a project in terms of the budget cap which comes in next year, especially given that Honda being still their supplier next year means little can be done this year in terms of setting up the funding and physical side of such a project. Unless of course Honda wish to financially assist in the project.
Clearly a lot of grey areas that would need to be resolved but I guess it is an option that RB would be keen to evaluate. Maybe a third party sponsor could take over the engine project as did Tag with the Porsche engine McLaren used back in the eighties.
At the end of the day Renault supplying engines is very much the easier route and may for budget cap fulfilment may be the only way forward for Red Bull in real world terms, but it does give RB options.
Also thinking re Max and any exit clauses, when is a Honda engine not a Honda engine.... is it still a Honda engine if made by Mugen, or even whoever builds their Indycar engines in the US. They are Honda engines but not made by Honda in Japan.
